But What Does HHFP Have to Say About it?

"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch) 03/28/2018 at 12:58 • Filed to: hammerhead says

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Its new car season, which means it’s time for what’s HHFP have to say about it. Because you were all waiting for it.

Today it’s the 2019 RAV4

I have feelings about the rav4, !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! , and so I have some interest in the lineage of this the first modern crossover.

So let me say this upfront - this is Toyota’s bread and butter and frankly they don’t care if you, lover of cars, don’t like it. People do and thats whats important to Toyota. Frankly the fact that they would take a risk...any risk...at alienating that fat part of the bell curve demo is gutsy and you have to respect that.

So hows it look? I like it. I realize we are only seeing the fancy trims here, but I think the shape is nice and I like the details. I think the paint choices are good and I like the two tone. The interior is also pretty great. its got a good blend of shapes, textures and materials and doesn’t look overwrought or underdone.

People are quick to look at the most exciting of the trims, the “Adventure Grade” model so lets do that. I think that is the worst name ever btw; A Recreation Activity Vehicle 4 wheel drive ought not to need an “adventure” version, but they needed to call that trim something other than “We can Subaru too”

I think it looks great, again, but what about the adventure bit?

What we know:

2.5 liter “dynamic force” engine. They haven’t told us the power rating but !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! to expect 60kw/l so figure around 200 hp. And you know what? That’s fine, 200 hp is going to be just fine. I would guess torque is in the neighborhood of 185 lbs-ft in the mid register. Toyota says the new dynamic force engines have strong low end torque which ought to help with an adventuring. (This engine in the camry: 203 hp @ 6600 rpm; 184 lb.-ft. @ 5000 rpm)

8 Speed auto - We don’t know the ratios but they say it loses less torque to slip, shifts faster and smoother, is lighter and will have a greater ratio spread. That means that there will be more gearing at low speeds to help it off road hopefully.

The Rav4 Adventure (2018) had a 4.07:1 final drive and the UA80F transmission in the highlander has a 5.519 1st gear, for a “crawl” ratio possibility of 22:46:1. Better than Jeep even. They won’t do this though because they will take advantage of the increased ratio spread to numerical lower the final (for the em pee gees). This is a good guess since Toyota isn’t tooting their horn about class leading crawl ratio. Expect a ratio in the 18:1 range, which while respectable won’t really enable much adventuring.

A claimed .5 inch increase in ground clearance across the board, bringing the totals up to...wait, really? sigh. 6.7 and 7.1 inches regular/adventure. So Don’t count on much here in the way of ground stomping either.

“True Off-Road Capabilities with Available Multi-Terrain Select and an Available Toyota-First, Dynamic Torque Vectoring All-Wheel Drive with Rear Driveline Disconnect”

What this means is that Toyota has a fully decoupling PTO system [ !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! ] with torque vectoring in the rear drive module, whether that torque vectoring is actually based on overdriving a single wheel like The Acura SH-AWD system/GNK twinster in the Focus RS, or just braking an inside wheel like the WRX is yet to be seen. Given that its called out as being a seperate option on different trim levels, I’m inclined to believe its actual hardware. Neat.

we have also been told it can “send 50 percent of engine torque to the rear wheels” and while you may think “oh cool, 50/50 like a real 4wd” remember key term here, “percent”. In a 4wd system that is “50/50", torque is evenly split and bias can occur to allow either axle to get 100% of torque depending on traction demands. Here, only 50% of torque can be sent to the rear drive module, meaning no less than 50% stays with the front wheels, even if they have no traction at all.

This also appears to be the first generation of RAV4 without a center differential “lock” button to override the computers selection for PTO lockup and provide maximum rear drive module torque under the right circumstances. Its been replaced with one of those stupid terrain dials that knows better than you do STOP ASKING!

It does come with a front and center TC off button, which is nice even though I expect it will be less an “off” and more a “please mom! I wont hurt myself I promise” button which will allow for some slip but still keep things nice and safe.

Also available will be a hybrid which will be faster and more powerful and have a totally decoupled electric drive module in the back which they claim can increase rear wheel torque 30% over the old unit (whatever that was). It comes with a CVT and will probably be just fine.

What I like:

The white roof

The shape

the interior (it really looks great)

The engine

The transmission

The attempt at an off road crossover

What I don’t like:

The follow through on the attempt to make an off-road crossover.

Frankly Im not going to cringe when people say they are looking at these now...which will be nice.

It will also be cool if Toyota can score a little of that isntagram mojo from Subaru and we start seeing these with BFG’s, a puck lift and some rally armor flaps. it will be just as silly as when its done to a crosstrek but it would be nice to see some level of enthusiasm for a toyota outside of their trucks.

Cmon, thats not bad

Those seats are...yeah. But you know, I love a little craziness in the seats. Why not? Your butt won’t care.

Under_Score > HammerheadFistpunch 03/28/2018 at 13:14

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I think the big issue with these mainstream vehicles trying to look “cool” is that you see so many of them that the cool factor goes away. Cars like the new Accord and the new Camry are everywhere now, so they look boring now. A 2012 Mitsubishi Galant, which looks a lot more boring, is a cooler car to me since they barely sold any. At least the 2013-2018 RAV4 was obvious that it was a RAV4, not a Nissan Rogue Sport/Hyundai Kona/Subaru Crosstrek.

HammerheadFistpunch > Under_Score 03/28/2018 at 13:15

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yeah but if you have to see them everywhere...don’t you want them to be pleasing to behold?

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > HammerheadFistpunch 03/28/2018 at 13:16

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Most Enthusiasts will like to shit on it but Toyota doesn’t care and the market for sure doesn’t care. I commented elsewhere that the Adventure trim is no CX-5 but looks better than the new CR-V at least. For people like my wife who wanted the new Crosstrek but with a hybrid, she would love the Adventure Trim or even the regular Hybrid 2019 despite the CVT.

Under_Score > HammerheadFistpunch 03/28/2018 at 13:17

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I’m at the point now where I’m liking the styling of vehicles like the Dodge Journey and not all this swoopy stuff. My RAV4 has a tire on the back, which is unique, but it still has that generic shape about it. No weird curves or bizarre front end designs.

HammerheadFistpunch > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 03/28/2018 at 13:21

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I would bet the new CVT is actually pretty good at not being horrible, especially with the torque fill of the electric motors.

HammerheadFistpunch > Under_Score 03/28/2018 at 13:23

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I hear ya. Simple tastes and all that. I guess I like this because its not as cheesy as the Renegage or gaudy as the Cherokee but also avoiding the “meh” of the forester and CRV.

random001 > HammerheadFistpunch 03/28/2018 at 13:24

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I hate to say that I don’t hate it.

Wait, it has no manual transmission option. I’ll get my pitchfork.

HammerheadFistpunch > random001 03/28/2018 at 13:26

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None of them do, not with AWD anyway. Rumor is we will be hearing about the death of the forester manual today too.

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > HammerheadFistpunch 03/28/2018 at 13:26

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I still think only Honda makes a decent CVT, was fine in the Civic. Tried the WRX and Forester CVT didn’t like it at all. I think the Prius’ CVT was unobtrusive and invisible which I guess is a good thing when it comes to CVTs. Nissan’s CVT is the worst as evidenced in several rentals.

fintail > HammerheadFistpunch 03/28/2018 at 13:41

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I think the trucky face is an improvement over the big mouth bass/predator look (although it might be making promises it can’t meet), but the backwards hat/faux floating C-pillar is a little triggersome.

HammerheadFistpunch > fintail 03/28/2018 at 13:45

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The c pillar is weak because the float is so tiny, but hey...those wind deflectors are functional and don’t look bad.

vicali > HammerheadFistpunch 03/28/2018 at 13:49

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I’d put this into the list to replace the SG Forester when the time comes..

sony1492 > HammerheadFistpunch 03/28/2018 at 13:49

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With the chunky tires it looks like a 4-runner from an alternate reality.

HammerheadFistpunch > vicali 03/28/2018 at 13:49

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me too, if I had one to replace. I mean, it can’t weight that much and 200 NA hp can’t be all that bad, right?

random001 > HammerheadFistpunch 03/28/2018 at 13:55

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Crosstrek still has a manual. His Noodly Holiness blesses you, Subaru...

HammerheadFistpunch > random001 03/28/2018 at 13:56

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for now.

random001 > HammerheadFistpunch 03/28/2018 at 13:57

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Bite your tongue!

Textured Soy Protein > HammerheadFistpunch 03/28/2018 at 14:11

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The interior pics are renders, material quality remains to be seen. Hopefully better than the shitty fake stitching on the Corolla steering wheel.

Also very irritating that while Toyota is finally introducing CarPlay & Alexa they stayed away from Android Auto.

fintail > HammerheadFistpunch 03/28/2018 at 14:11

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I want no float. It’s a trend that should vanish yesterday.

The rear deflector is functional, but I would rather it be cleanly integrated rather than made to stand out like a kind of spoiler. It’s funny - those who want something sporty often want a sleeper that doesn’t hint of potential, those who want a 4 wheeled toaster want a pretense of sport.

HammerheadFistpunch > Textured Soy Protein 03/28/2018 at 14:12

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yea, strange that.

benjrblant > HammerheadFistpunch 03/28/2018 at 14:54

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Honestly, I’m excited about this. I feel somewhat shameful admitting that I’m excited about a Rav4/Crossover, but I am. I think this is the first Rav since Gen1 that I not only don’t mind of but somewhat like . 7" of ground clearance is sufficient for most gravel service roads and just ideal for the occasional unplowed driveway/road. 200hp and 8 speeds is enough to make me want to forget the underpowered Crosstrek which struggles with the mountain passes here.

Toyota is making vehicles that I find exciting and I don’t know how to feel about that because they haven’t since 1997. Could they finally be shaking the beige infection?

Funktheduck > HammerheadFistpunch 03/28/2018 at 15:21

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If I were in the market for a CUV I’d test drive one of these. Looks pretty good combined with Toyota reliability.

BJ > HammerheadFistpunch 03/28/2018 at 23:02

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A reporter here once commented to the effect that buying a new Toyota is a compromise: you know it’s a reliable and durable vehicle, which means looking at its ugly mug for many years.

Toyota design is going in the right direction overall. I saw a brand-new Camry (XSE I think) this week. It looked pretty darn good, and it was even white, which seems to be a pretty rare colour for this car.

Cooperd0g > HammerheadFistpunch 03/28/2018 at 23:10

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People like to badmouth cars like this and the Crosstrek, but they have decent utility. When we bought my wife’s Impreza we decided against the up charge for the Crosstrek since we had a full size Titan. Having sold the Titan I took the Impreza hunting recently and was bottoming our on sandy rutted roads. To be safe I went back out, parked in a safe spot, and walked over a mile in. The 3 extra inches of clearance in the Crosstrek, or something like this, Renegade, etc would have been nice to have.

HammerheadFistpunch > Cooperd0g 03/29/2018 at 15:37

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I totally feel ya, They aren’t best sellers for nothing after all. That being said even the Adventure grade of this slightly lifted generation you wouldn’t have much more clearance. The highest clearance on these is about 7 inches.